Amway Leader Threatens Beating
by Doug Wead on December 3, 2009
in Network Marketing
Ме?ньше зна?ешь — кре?пче спишь.
“The less you know the better you sleep.”
- A Russian proverb
Amway Leader Threatens Beating
On a trip to Russia last October my translator told me about an angry telephone call from one of the local leaders set up by the Amway Corporation. This particular person is a friend whom I admire. But I was now with XanGo, a different company.
According to my translator, he was furious, huffing and puffing. Someone from the corporation had called him to say that I was contacting his Amway leaders, trying to recruit them into XanGo. “Doesn’t Doug Wead know that he is being followed by Amway Security everywhere he goes?” the leader told my translator, “Isn’t Doug Wead afraid of getting beaten up? You tell him to stay away from my ‘Diamonds.’” (A “Diamond” is Amway nomenclature for a top earner.)
“Now, just a minute,” my translator said. “Has Doug Wead contacted one of your Diamonds? Name one?”
“Well,” the Amway leader said, “I can’t say.”
“Okay, so settle down. He is here to speak for a XanGo corporate function in St. Petersburg and he has to meet with some of the parents of children who attend his school. (I help run a private Christian boarding school in Oregon.) And he has to settle old business accounts but he is only meeting with people who have asked to see him and need to see him. And that’s all. Who told you he was contacting Amway leaders?”
“Well,” the man allegedly replied. “Someone from the company called me to warn me.”
“Well, they are wrong. Mr. Wead has not initiated contact with a single Amway distributor, Diamond or otherwise.”
Of course, that was not the complete story. The fact is that I had met with one Amway leader, at his initiative, and afterward, when all the Amway leaders were called and warned not to meet with me, “the phone started ringing off the hook.” Diamonds wanted to meet me for dinner, for lunch, for breakfast, for in between. Their curiosity was insatiable. Why did I go to XanGo? Is Amway going retail? Are they dumping expired products from Malaysia on the Russian black market? Why are they requiring loyalty tests? Are they going to end systems income? Are they trying to change the laws in Russia to outlaw systems? How will we live or make any money without it? How can you build the business without functions and cd’s?
Now, here is where it gets really funny. I can’t speak Russian. I don’t even know how to spell the names of any of these people. I don’t have their phone numbers or addresses. In all my years I have never taken business cards or collected names or built a mailing list. Why would I? These are Amway leaders whom I respect. They invite me onto their stage, why would I want to hurt their businesses? I had my own reasons for getting into XanGo. (See: Why I Chose XanGo.)
In Moscow, later in the week, when I met with one of the parents from the Christian school in Oregon he laughed about it all, “Well, well, you are causing quite a fuss. I am getting all kinds of phone calls from Amway leaders saying that their security people are following you and they are taking pictures. Anyone who gets their picture taken with Doug Wead is in danger of getting kicked out of Amway.” We both suddenly looked to the restaurant window where a student with a back pack held up his cell phone. Making a call or taking a picture? And then we both made ugly faces and laughed.
On my trip to Russia I had requested only one meeting with an Amway leader and that was with Natasha Yena, a wonderful person with great networking skills. My purpose for meeting her was to set the ground rules on what I should say or not say or how I should act as a new XanGo distributor. Of course, I didn’t need her permission or her suggestions. I wanted them. I know very well how hard it is to build a network. And I had a lot of fans in Russia. I had, and still have, no intention of trying to recruit Diamonds. If there are any more of you out there trying to call just hold your horses. I have no interest in taking you from Amway. If you are making money and are happy, just stay where you are.
On the last night I sat in the lobby of the Marriott Hotel in Moscow, talking with a former Diamond, who had called me and asked to meet with me. His ex-wife was still in Amway and according to him the company was now threatening her income. How would she and their children survive? During the meeting he got an anxious telephone call. “We know you are meeting with Doug Wead right at this moment in the lobby of the Marriott hotel.”
But he interrupted the threatening caller, “I’m not in Amway,” he retorted angrily, “Talk to my ex-wife.” And then he hung up on them. At least, that is how it was all explained to me in translation, this happening right in front of me.
We all paused to consider the irony of the moment and had a big laugh. He and my translator explained that they had all been through this before during the Soviet era. It was what often happened to ordinary citizens in those days. Threatening people was common. But it was amusing to see it acted out again in Russia with associates of an American corporation calling itself Amway. (The American Way.)
When I returned to the United State I spoke to a very kind and reasonable man from the American Amway Corporation. He has been with them for years and he assured me that he has never seen such things. “Amway doesn’t follow people.” And he promised to look into it.
Meanwhile, I resolved to forget the whole thing. Who wants trouble? In the last 30 days I received only a few random communications from Russia and not necessarily from top leaders. And then?
Once again I started getting calls from Diamonds, this time from friends who were warning me. One note said that, “reprisals have begun.” What did that mean?
And finally late last night a warning call from Russia. An Amway Diamond had talked to my friend. “Is it true,” the Diamond had asked, “Is Doug Wead speaking at a XanGo event in Astana, Kazakhstan on December 15, 2009?”
“I’m not sure,” my friend hesitated. By the way, XanGo is perfectly legal in Kazakhstan and they have a large group there. Amway is not legal in that country, although they have tens of thousands involved. And then the Diamond said to my friend, “If Doug Wead comes to Astana we will have to take protective measures.”
Now, what would that mean, I wondered? And then I was told a chilling story. Attila Gidofalvi, a leading distributor in the Forever Living Company, had just visited Kazakhstan. Attila, like me, was also a former Amway distributor. And his company, Forever Living, like XanGo, is also legal in Kazakhstan. But Attila, I was told, the man who is called the father of Amway in Russia, the man who once had 122 diamonds, including Natasha, was accosted and beaten in Kazakhstan. Could this be true?
Once more, the story was just too unbelievable for me to fathom. But this afternoon I worked up the energy to track down Attila himself and eventually found him. I put him on speaker phone and brought in a witness to hear his story. He said he was attacked on a train by some people identifying themselves as Amway distributors. They beat him badly. Then they threatened to kill him if he returned to their country. When the train arrived at its destination he and his traveling companion reported it to the police but his assailants were gone.
I was told by my caller to hire bodyguards, and good ones, when I visit Russia next week. It will be part of an around the world trip. And yes, I will be stopping by Astana, Kazakhstan, a great city, in a great country. But why would I need bodyguards to protect me from people I love?
It has been my pleasure to work with Amway on many levels for 35 years. Most of them are great people, who have done great things. When I worked in the White House years ago I proudly arranged for several of their leaders to sit next to the President at events I moderated, knowing that they would give him good and sound advice. At my urging and nomination, one was appointed to a Presidential Commission.
But the great leaders I worked with are retired. And I know that big corporations sometimes delegate their “problems” to public relations firms, who hire former police and intelligence people to solve especially knotty challenges. (See an exaggerated, Hollywood version of this in the recent movie Duplicity.) And sometimes these projects get out of hand, as in “We’ll take care of this, just leave it to us. And don’t ask questions.” And sometimes it may result in “a beating.” And sometimes things get set into motion that cannot be called back.
So just for the record, I am making this public, so that if I should be found in my hotel room in Moscow with a heart attack or found unconscious on the streets of Astana after an apparent random mugging, you won’t blame it on Russia or Kazakhstan. It is probably someone’s version of “public relations.” (Imagine actually having to pay money for that sort of thing?) Or maybe it is a case of some bad apples in a company culture that has so much power that it is getting a little out of control, and has lost its way, and its values, and its purpose and has made the dollar more important than the lives of its own people.
Hopefully, this all has a simple explanation. If not, let me state the obvious, if think you have to hire ex-police and spies to follow and photograph and intimidate your own people to keep them from leaving your company, if you think you have to track your competitors and threaten to harm them, you just may have already lost the war. And you misunderstand your own leadership, who were promised that they could be “Independent Business Owners” not employees who must take loyalty tests and who are now arbitrarily audited by corporate chosen “vendors”, who are sometimes their very own crossline rivals, competing for the same money.
Hopefully, this sort of thing won’t be repeated when I return to Russia. If it is, I will be sure to keep you informed, for my own protection, of course, and for the sake of my five children and for the public record. And then, also, to keep those of you who are students of “public relations” up to date on the latest techniques – American style. Who knows? Maybe this sort of thing works and society doesn’t really care.
I got out of Amway a few years ago. I have seen some of my friends who were Diamonds and Emeralds have their distributorships pulled for various reasons. I didn’t like the direction the company was taking after some of the top people retired!
Amway’s IBO “leaders” are not the pristine examples of human virtue you describe. They are LCKs, (Lying Cowardly “Kingpins”) who make most of their profit from the Amway tool scam, and about 99% of IBOs operate at a net loss as a result. Read about it on my blog, I suggest you start here: http://tiny.cc/D5oJh and forward the information to everyone you know, so they don’t get scammed.
Doug, I am so sorry to hear about this. I think i can speak for your family, friends and associates when I say, be careful. And yes Tex, not examples of human virtue is putting it lightly, we are talking assault, intimidation, threats, this is absolutely despicable behavior. What is Amway doing to stop this kind of activity? Their leaders should be outraged. Again, be careful.
Clearly the behaviour of the self-identified Amway “thugs” is beyond the pale – but it’s my understanding Gidofalvi was kicked out of Amway because it was *he* that setup these “illegal” networks in markets like Khazakstan … what goes around comes around I guess, Russia is certainly still a different world.
Still Doug, you’re stretching belief a little with claiming to meet Natasha Yena just to get some help with how to be a new Xango distributor! Please … pull the other leg … it’s got bells on it … ding ding ding!
Laura,
I’m not talking about Doug’s story, I’m talking about the Amway tool scam. Click on the link to learn about the Amway tool scam: http://tiny.cc/D5oJh
It is unbelievable that Amway would stoop to such lows. Please be very careful during your travels!
It’s in Amway/Quixtar’s interest to do everything in their power to put an end to this kind of behavior to prevent such bad press. How embarrassing.
Doug, someone has to watch your back. Such a report lends immense credibility to our mutual friend’s claims of physical beating + drugging from his upline and that happened here in the USA. There seem to be many people from the dark side willing to do just about anything. Please take a bodyguard…..you are rich and famous. You are a huge asset to Xango.
Wow! That is some letter. Doug is such a fine man. I do hope the “threats” stop and the people who are afraid of XanGo will realize it isn’t Doug who started XanGo and certainly he has not had a hand in why we are so successful now. He only joined us in the last year and XanGo has been breaking records, making news, receiving awards… for 7 years! If they are scared their own company isn’t good enough to stand on it’s own then they need to address that issue with logic (and peace).
IBOFightBack, please explain what other possible reason I would have for meeting with Natasha Yena? She is a Crown Ambassador whom I respect and know well.
This is nothing new, I remember back in the 80’s when Old World was our (Amway) main competition. Dex told us it was being handled by nailing fishes to doors of distributors in Old World. I left awhile back. IBO, i have followed your writtings and have admired your work. I read on the internet now that Amway pays you to write complimentary things about them. That being said, how can you turn away and not comment on the fact that a human being has been beaten over an mlm dispute? Check back with those who write your check and see how they feel about all of this.
Doug,
Maybe it was to get tips from her on how to import the Amway tool scam into Xango?
Richard,
You can read virtually anything on the internet, what makes you think what ibofb writes is worth getting paid? Or that Doug’s story has anything to do with reality?
I am speechless to think that this could happen. But this world of insanity and greed goes on… Please, please, please be careful, Doug. Prayers of protection and wisdom cover you all the way there and home.
Merry,
Such drama. We don’t even know if any of this is true. Doug should probably be more concerned when he is over there from “regular” crime.
What a shame to fight over something so great.NETWORK MARKETING. I respect everyone decision and this is freedom.
Let the bells ring and do your thing and you wont have to fight over something that is suppose to be that good.
I myself was involve with Amway for 35 years and breaking records that no one as beaten. Now today happy to be doing what I love helping people helping themselve with a business that doesnt fight over who will be making money with TOOLS and MEETINGS
Wow, I heard and saw some strange things with Amway leaders and this confirms things haven’t changed. Sorry you have to go through this, Doug, especially being in the public eye as you are. I am forever grateful for what I learned from you while I was working with Bob Proctor, and think its a shame that there are people operating from such low vibrations out there, trying to affect those who are doing such great work and helping others. My thoughts are with you and your family.
Andre,
I found tons of negative information about ACN in less than 5 minutes. Why don’t you explain how wrong it is?
Andrea,
Doug was an LCK (Lying Cowardly “Kingpin”) when he was with Amway, so don’t feel sorry for him. Go ahead to Russia without security Doug, we won’t miss you if you never come back.
This whole situation is so bizarre. Having been with Amway very briefly many years ago, I know a few Amway distributors, some of whom are good friends. Becase of that, it’sdifficult to believe that Amway Corp in the US would have any part in any of this. So I suspect it’s limited to Russia, which definitely has a different set of values when it comes to business and money.
The only thing positive to ay about it is that obviously some people are feeling threatened by Xango’s success — and perhaps that’s an indication that our wonderful company may be making inroads into the network marketing world in Russia. However, it seems to me that Xango and Amway can co-exist happily in any country: There’s more than enough business for everyone, no matter what company we work for. No one need feel their business is being threatened by us.
Incredible! The quickest way to increase blog readership by two is to write a piece about Amway or Quixtar. Tex and IBOfightsback are on them like white on rice. Doug, perhaps they are the two Amway will send to get their message across!
Personally I find every word of this believable. Just like a wounded animal that’s cornered, a company on a down hill slide will use no holds barred. Note: It’s Amway’s MO to then blame a wayward IBO for bad behavior. I find them very similar to ACORN. Tex and IBOfightsback remind me of the Rathke brothers, who have also gone international after having problems in North America. The similarities are eerie!
Finally, read your contracts people! Know every consequence of the non-compete clause. Understand no quality company has secret arbitration . It speaks volumes to the type of people your dealing with here. They cloak everything in secrecy. Your Amway/Quixtar contract is not written to favor you the IBO. There are quality MLM companies out there to offer you great opportunities. Do your homework, this is not one of them, anymore.
Peter,
Many fictional stories are bizarre.
Nonprofit,
If Amway sent both of us on a trip, only one of us would return, and it wouldn’t be ibofb. The contract is far too complex for a typical person to understand, which is the way Amway apparently wants it.
Amway is a scam, and here’s why: Amway wants to pay out as little money as they can get away with, so they support the higher level IBOs ripping off their downline via the tool scam. As a result, about 99% of IBOs operate at a net loss, while the 1% make several TIMES more from their Amway tool scam than from the Amway products. Read about it on my blog, I suggest you start here: http://tiny.cc/D5oJh and forward the information to everyone you know, so they don’t get scammed.
Some Amway diamonds could really be good actors/actresses on Amway motivational stage, but off stage they could be the meanest people on a downline who does not come up with their expectations! Had a bad experience myself. Doug Wead am glad you “Chose Xango”. Praying for your safety!
If this story is true as Doug states, it sort of validates some of what was described in Merchants of Deception.
Rose,
Some? How about most, or almost every one of them?
Having spent some time in Russia and other former countries of the eastern bloc I do0n’t think this story sounds bizarre or unlikely at all – I also think it has almost nothing to do with Amway, it’s more to do with what is unfortunately not uncommon business practices in the former Soviet Union. It will take another generation or two before what’s “normal” in the west becomes normal in the east. Of course what’s “normal” in the west isn’t necessarily ethical either.
The story says an Amway representative (a diamond?) is making threats. This is common business practice for Amway???
ibofb,
In other words, you agree with my December 4 comment.
I just had to get in on this. At first sounds okay, they are picking on Amway. Then this IBO character comes on and in essence says “he was operating illegally in countries where he shouldn’t have been. Serves him right.” Wait a minute. Is this Amway’s policy? If so IBO fightback should resign rather than be with such a crowd. If not, Amway should once and for all withdraw all subsidies from this IBO character and renounce what he said. Unless they approve of murder. Oh, and also, does this apply to all IBO’s who have ever operated in a country before it opened? Or just this one person?
IBOFB, the Amway Defender of the Faith:
“…I also think it has almost nothing to do with Amway…..”
Part of the story was:
“He said he was attacked on a train by some people identifying themselves as Amway distributors. They beat him badly.”
Nothing to do with Amway at all, other than the usual insulating themselves from their distributor’s actions.
Nothing new there, pretty much par for the course.
Amway – A Bastion of prosperity and wholesome family values…..
Good damage control David Steadson, but not good enough that anyone would ever take it seriously.
1FormerIBO – there’s around 4000 currently qualified Diamonds and a lot more former Diamonds. If it was “common practice” I’m sure you’d hear about it more often. Rocket – you understood what I meant. Violence and threats in business is a (relatively) common *Russian* business practice. It’s not a relatively common Amway business practice. Guess what – most IBOs in Russia speak Russian too – and it’s got nothing to do with the fact they’re Amway IBOs!
Laura,
To answer your reasonable questions, as it appears rockette and ibofb are consumed with each others’ egos:
Is this Amway’s policy? —- Yes, it is well known you cannot expand into a country before it officially opens, as laws particular to the new country could be quite different, so if they enter before it officially opens, the country may not allow Amway to open, and this puts other IBOs at a disadvantage when it does open.
If so IBO fightback should resign rather than be with such a crowd. —- Should all golfers quit playing golf because Tiger is a male whore?
If not, Amway should once and for all withdraw all subsidies from this IBO character and renounce what he said. —- Which IBO are you talking about, the one who got booted?
Unless they approve of murder. —- I doubt it, now YOU are getting ridiculous.
Oh, and also, does this apply to all IBO’s who have ever operated in a country before it opened? —- Yes.
Or just this one person? —- No.
Laura, you misinterpreted what I said and clearly missed my earlier comment where I clearly decried any threats of violience.
My points is that, as networkers know, you are who you associate with. From what I understand Gidofalví was actively breaking Amway’s rules, which is why he was kicked out. His (former) associates who continue to operate “illegally” in Khazakstan are clearly “rule breakers” as well – they do not “represent” Amway, they’re not even supposed to be Amway business owners.
John Maxwell once said something along the lines of “if they’re willing to lie and cheat for you, then they’ll be willing to lie and cheat from you”.
ibofb,
It’s actually quite easy to misinterpret what you say, you ALWAYS talk in namby-pamby language. I associated with LCKs for years, but I am NOT an LCK. John Maxwell is a jerk, he teaches “leadership” but leaves out “honesty”, just like the rest of the LCKs.
I read merhcants of deception and in that story, threats were made against an Amway detractor. This is similar. Seems some Amway agents behave like the mafia.
Wow, “they” are probably tracing YOUR IP address right now, circling your home, ready to open fire! LOL
1formeribo
Yes, some Amway folks do behave like the mafia.
People who are much more knowledgeable and educated about the topic than IBOFB (David Steadson) also feel the same way, and have testified under oath to that effect.
And David, you understood perfectly what I meant about Amway insulating themselves from the IBO actions.
You raison d’etre consists of muddying up the waters about any information about Amway that casts it in a poor light.
You either discredit the source or the information as best as your able, in most cases simply confusing the issue.
It’s almost as pathetic as it is deliberate.
Almost.
Agreed. Have you seen his latest bullshit on his blog, where he constantly says, “I’ve heard….”, or “It’s my understanding….”, or “Someone told me….” and similar phrases, where he attempts to explain away the tool scam? He relies on the UK decision when it supports his position, then discounts it when it doesn’t. Pathetic and deliberate, I call it a tie: http://www.amwaytalk.com/united-kingdom-republic-of-ireland-f21/business-seminar-roi-january-2010-t1044-20.html?sid=ab6f5927ea67a4aa61d54bf9e90a4aa0
There seems to be a theme of loyalty with Amway groups. They describe some business actions as a “cause”. It has characteristsics of a cult where members would gladly “take one for the leader”.
I don’t think it’s real loyalty, it’s more creating a state of dependency on the tool scam. Amway is a scam, and here’s why: Amway wants to pay out as little money as they can get away with, so they support the higher level IBOs ripping off their downline via the tool scam. As a result, about 99% of IBOs operate at a net loss, while the top 1% make several TIMES more from their Amway tool scam than from the Amway products. Read about it on my blog, I suggest you start here: http://tiny.cc/D5oJh and forward the information to everyone you know, so they don’t get scammed.
This isn’t anything new. Just look at what happend to Bruce Anderson. He has been threatened and harrassed for years and years. Just see his website. http://www.baron55.com then talk about how fair “The Big A” is
Is it just me, or is Baron55 seemingly always under construction?
Tex, stop with the “read my blog” deal. If you are not happy with a company or a process, don’t participate. People are not hog tied and forced to buy, do, say anything. If they buy the tools, it’s because they choose to. If someone is making a profit, it may not be the most ethical way to do business but people still have a choice here in America. Amway does over $7 billion in annual sales (not tools) they must do something right. How much did you make last year? More than $7 billion?
Rockette,
Visit http://www.baron55.com/FBI.html
Lolita,
Go to hell. Amway is a scam, and here’s why: Amway pays out as little money as they can get away with, so they support the higher level IBOs ripping off their downline via the tool scam. As a result, about 99% of IBOs operate at a net loss, while the top 1% make several TIMES more from their Amway tool scam than from the Amway products. Read about it on my blog, I suggest you start here: http://tiny.cc/D5oJh and forward the information to everyone you know, so they don’t get scammed.
Rockette,
“Visit http://www.baron55.com/FBI.html”
Lolita,
Go to hell. Amway is a scam, and here’s why: Amway pays out as little money as they can get away with, so they support the higher level IBOs ripping off their downline via the tool scam. As a result, about 99% of IBOs operate at a net loss, while the top 1% make several TIMES more from their Amway tool scam than from the Amway products. Read about it on my blog, I suggest you start here: “http://tiny.cc/D5oJh” and forward the information to everyone you know, so they don’t get scammed.
Geez, Tex, you are one bitter SOB. Go to church and find some comfort.
Amway was a great company w/ great people in an amazing beginning of an industry that helped the average person achieve more in personal development and a dream of a better life. But this corp has clearly lost its way being run by people who don’t know what it’s like to build an organisation (like Rich and Jay did before Amway), 2nd generation billionaire kids, and won’t change their way of doing business to make it a better business for its’ distributors.
And you are all right, too many lawyers/ public relation/ corporate mucky mucks making the simple things extremely difficult.
Some Reasons that Amway is not a good part-time home based business choice anymore…
1 compensation plan was invented before they had computers and is not adequate in total payout (by some estimates) as low as 33%, where current top mlm’s pay 50%. comp plan doesn’t reward team building/ depth building. comp plan doesn’t reward lower levels. comp plan is not even guaranteed anymore when you hit levels, it’s to the corp’s discretion. they probably have a naughty list.
imagine building a huge network and not get paid because you didn’t tow the company line?
2 reputation is too bad now. as soon as someone is exposed to the opportunity, they hop on their iphone and voila- all negative. how can new distributors have a good start?
3 takes $700 CAD to make 150points. way too expensive, even if you can convince people that the products are boutique quality, but they’re not, because boutique comes w/ a name that people want.
4 products are not innovative and not what consumers want. avon has a better reputation for making products that people want and are willing to pay for.
5 the corp has mistreated too many top level distributors over the last few years. who would want that kind of treatment after devoting a lifetime of attention and work to a corp?
6 the iboa board is no longer an organisation that can protect the distributors. they have proven that when they 100% voted against quixtar’s name change back to Amway and the corp did it anyways.
7 no cohesion between the corp and the ‘field’
8 wasted money spent on reputation management and brand recognition. if these 100′s of millions spent on athlete endorsements, tv ads, fancy image campaigns were given as a beef up to anemic comp plan that would be a better investment.
9 sueing people for leaving a business that they are no longer happy in or can see a bright future with. sueing everyone in site. free enterprise?
10 focus is not on making bus better where it’s not, but opening new countries, etc.
11 where is the success? what do the numbers say? how many people joined amway globally in last 10yrs? how many NEW platinums are there? how long do they stay at platinum and do they go beyond that level? how many people quit each year? what are the real sales figures if you count inflation/ currency fluctuations? how many platinums, rubies, emeralds, diamonds and above have left amway for other mlm opportunities in last 10yrs? are they all wrong?
Peter,
Since when is telling the truth being “one bitter SOB?” Why should I comply with someone who wants me to give up my 1st Amendment right?
I already go to church, and God is pissed as well. In fact, He encourages me to keep doing what I’m doing.
Peter, Tex is a troll who visits every blog he’s not banned from and insults people and sepws his hatred on all. I read another blog by DOug Wead where he made appalling racist statements. He is only capable of repeating the same thing over and over like a tape recorder. Don’t waste your time engaging the troll.
Paul,
You’re a wimp. LOL